Download a transcript of this episode
1. [6:47] Anti antibiotics
2. [11:48] Paleo research
3. [18:18] Religious fasting
4. [20:40] I, Caveman Home Edition
5. [26:53] Laser weight loss
6. [33:14] HCG diet
7. [39:55] Efficacy of PEDs
8. [58:35] K Fibre
Questions:
1. Anti anti-biotic and the Paleo solution
Damon says:
Robb
Never been a fan of the use of anti biotics and have successfully avoided needing any prescription over past 15 years. Unfortunately, that ended three days ago when diagnosed with Microplasma (http://www.emedicine.com/EMERG/topic467.htm) and I need to go on a course of antibiotic called Citrobay. Now this anti biotic is dealing me with some nasty side affects such as severe nausea, headaches, and dizziness for about three hours after I take a dose, but unfortunately I’ve been told by doctor need to go through course as only way to get rid of the Microplasma.
Are there Paleo friendily foods, herbal solutions, or other supplements that you are aware of would assist deal dealing with the side affects of taking anti biotics?
2. Paleo-related research
Steve says:
Hi Robb and Gregg,
Love the podcast, the book and the website. I admit that I sometimes get lost in the minute scientific details but enjoy these discussions regardless. I always get something out of it (or at least I think I do).
As for me, I’ve been Paleo since July and have seen steady improvements in weight, energy and overall well-being. So much so that my wife decided to join “the plan” with me at the beginning of the school year along with our two kids. But my question is sort of a pie-in-the-sky:
If you were a billionaire–of the Bruce Wayne variety–and wanted to fund research into Paleo-related fields, what are the top three studies you would want to see through to completion?
Keep up the great work,
Thanks,
3. Religious Fasting
Anne Marie says:
Hello! I tried doing the Primal diet last year and was successful in it but I had difficulty incorporating it with our lengthy church fast. It seemed like my body was always playing catch up to meat and then no meat. etc …(Eastern Orthodox Christian). … I have a link here if you are unfamiliar with it.
http://www.antiochian.org/node/18518
Do you have any helpful tips for religious fasting and regulating the switch that occurs during the periods between fasting and non fasting to avoid a dip in energy?
Thank you so much.
4. I, Caveman Home Edition
Ian says:
Robb,
Although I expected some Spurlockian B.S. beforehand, I really ended up enjoying the “I, Caveman” series. Spurlock was humorous and didn’t talk about the saturated fat content of that elk, so he and I are square despite the lies in “Supersize Me.” Anyway, first off: Elk + Atlatl + Robb Wolf = Most badass thing I’ve ever seen; awesome job– though, it was really sobering to see the emotion the kill brought about. Anyway, my question is this: how would you feel about someone trying a smaller-scale form of this experiment on their own? I’m in college and my best friends back home and I have a 1-2 day hiking/camping trip planned somewhere in the Appalachians. I’ve wanted to try some form of “survival” for years now, so seeing you, someone I idolize/respect, do it, I’m now more gung-ho than ever. So what do you think? Can five college kids hope to attempt a 3-day survive-athon in the mountains with basic gears & survival training and some research into wild edibles and trapping? If we were to attempt this, how would you go about preparation (ie. what to bring and what knowledge is essential)?
Thanks a lot wildman,
5. WTF? Sharks with Lasers For Fat Loss?
Andrew says:
Ok, so there are no sharks with lasers on their heads but I thought it would get your attention. This is not really a Paleo related question but I have been Paleo for 4 months now (great results) and I listen to the podcast often and know you to be a smart, fair, and scientific individual. Would appreciate your insight on this, so here goes.
I live out on the east coast of Canada (in Fredericton NB, believe you know some CrossFit folks out this way) and recently a company has opened up shop in our area promising that they can use laser technology to “melt your fat” away and make your skinnier and healthier.
When I heard this I just shrugged it off and assumed it was more of the common quackery that is the “quick weight loss” industry. If people wanted to waste their money on this, so be it. However, recently they have started a very aggressive advertising campaign on a popular local radio station. The radio station personalities involved are extremely popular and influential in the community as well as on social media. From the sounds of it at least one of the hosts seems to be giving the impression that his new found health is directly attributable to this procedure (he is also very big on nutrition and exercise, and this is being overshadowed by the advert campaign).
Now I could care less really what the general public wants to do with this as I am all for personal accountability. However with this aggressive campaign I worry about people that I am close to actually trying this thing out. Luckily they actually post a bit of background and clinical trial information on their website so I took a read.
Essentially they are claiming to liquify the fat and it escapes the cells through a small hole made by the laser. I’m sure there is more to it but my background is in IT, not bio-chemistry. I read through a few others and they also claim it reduces Leptin levels (is this even a good idea?) as well as LDL cholesterol levels (no mention of what type of LDL is reduced). There is also some mention of increased levels of oxidation that I was not sure on since it seemed to me that they were trying to portray this as a good thing.
The most damning seems to be that most of this is non-randomized, non-blind trials. The one clinical trial they did was short term and the notes on it even say that they had not done any long term analysis on what the effects of this could be.
Do you mind taking a look at this and letting me know what you think? Maybe release the Kraken on it? The procedure is apparently approved by the FDA and Health Canada. You can find more here http://www.panaceaatlantic.com/what-is-zerona
If it is relatively harmless and the only danger is a drain on the bank account I’m all for just letting fools be fools. If this is potentially dangerous I’d like enough ammo to try and dissuade anybody I care about from signing up.
Thanks and keep up the great work.
6. IHCG
David says:
Hey Robb and Greg,
My boss was talking to me about going on the IHCG (I believe that is Human Chorianic Gonadotropin) diet. Apparently it involves taking IHCG every day and dropping down to a 500 cal/day diet. I am adamantly against it, especially since he is planning to run a marathon this spring. Do you know about this diet? Is there any semblance of sanity to the idea of “resetting your metabolism” by starving yourself and taking a hormone?
Would you also be able to compare it to Cordain’s Paleo for Athletes? I claimed that he can “reset his metabolis” by continuing to exercise and following the Paleo for Athletes protocol. But he’s my boss, so what do I know?
Thanks for all the help in the past. Love what you guys do.
7. Efficacy of PED’s
Tom says:
Robb & Greg,
Over the past year, the subject of PED use amongst athletes seems to have become a popular topic in the media. Whether it be HGH, steroids, ect… there seems to be a weekly story regarding one of these substances. Coming from your background in biochemistry ,as well as Greg’s in weightlifting, from a research review or anecdotal standpoint, what would you say are the true risks associated with taking such substances? The media seems to play if off as one of the most deadly substances on the planet, yet more people die from Tylenol overdose each year. In contrast, documentaries like “Bigger Faster Stronger” depict a much brighter picture supporting the efficacy of their use. Obviously I’m not asking either of you to endorse them, but it’d certainly be nice to get the opinion of an unbiased source. Thanks for everything, and keep the podcasts coming because they’re literally the only thing keeping me sane during long drives!
8. K Fibre?
Duncan says:
Hi guys,
I have a question about a product i saw on tv a few days back called called K Fibre.
http://www.kfibre.com/index.html
It is basically the fibrous pulp left over from sugar cane milling, dried and ground to a fine powder which (apparently) performs like wheat flour, but has practically no energy as it is mostly just insoluble fibre.
Have you heard of this stuff, and do you think it has any place in a low carb/paleo diet?
I like the idea of being able to eat pie and pizza again on occasion, but isn’t this basically like eating sawdust? And if so, does it really matter?
Thanks for the podcast, a great resource and very entertaining.
Going paleo has helped lower my blood pressure, reduce
my waist line and has eased the aching, arthritis like pain from several old injuries which i used to suffer in cold weather. Still hurts, but nowhere near as much.
Cheers,
Patrick says
Hey guys. Doesn’t look like there’s a link to this podcast… Just saying.
Kirill says
http://traffic.libsyn.com/robbwolf/PaleoSolution-Episode108.mp3
Dr.Andro says
Just use this one, guys > http://traffic.libsyn.com/robbwolf/PaleoSolution-Episode108.mp3
Cromulent says
Sharks with lasers? I prefer sharks with *freakin’* lasers.
“Can five college kids hope to attempt a 3-day survive-athon in the mountains with basic gears & survival training and some research into wild edibles and trapping?”
First step in research: watch Deliverance first. Don’t take a banjo with you. If anybody in your party looks like Ned Beatty, suggest he stay home.
Jeff Bonn says
Holy crap, Austrian economics in the first five minutes!
George says
Anne Marie,
A fellow Orthodox Christian here. In terms of foods to eat during a fast it depends on how strict you are (whether you avoid all plant oils during a fast or not). If you only avoid olive oil during the week, then it’s pretty easy IMO, just boil up some taters and add generous amounts of coconut oil. If you avoid all plant oils it’s pretty much impossible to eat paleo during lenten periods – especially the first week of the Great Lent. Just sprout your lentils and make sourdough bread, or buy sprouted flour to make bread. Just fill up on wine/shellfish during the weekends. 🙂
I’ve never had problems transitioning to/from lenten periods. Maybe look into advice for people who are transitioning off of vegan diets.
stone temple paleo says
Ive heard of that laser treatment for fat loss, it does apparently work and may be a good aid in people who want to lose some fat while on the road to a helathier lifestyle.
From what I understand this laser treatment doesnt banish fat forever, if you go back to your careless lifestyle the weight will come back
Mel says
I’ll be interested to hear this. I went on homeopathic HCG and lost 15 lb in about a month. I’ve kept it off. Pretty amazing stuff. I eat Paleo and Crossfit 3x/week…
I also kept up working out 3x a week on the diet. I didn’t go crazy and try to PR everything, in fact my lifts weren’t 100% during it, but I didn’t want to stop moving. One trainer knew what I was up to, and so he kept an eye on me like a big brother. 🙂
Nothing I did worked – low carb Paleo, Zone-Paleo, less calories, green Vitamix drinks (ie kale and water), etc. I tried Tim Ferriss’ “4 Hour Body” diet… I lost like 5 lb and gained it all back. I carry the majority of my fat in my abdominal area or “thorax”. Below my gut, my legs & butt are solid muscle.
I was stuck at 165-168 lb (5’5″, size 10 woman…so, you can see I was pretty “dense” and have some muscle). Now I roam around 151 – 154 lb and am a solid size 8. For me, that one dress size makes a huge difference! I’m still not “thin” but I look way better naked and my belly is smaller (still there though).
I hate to say it, but sometimes you resort to crazy stuff to get the results you want.
The other big thing I’ve noticed – the really restrictive diet really made me pay attention to when I was ACTUALLY hungry and not just bored and looking for food.
Rusty says
Keep it libertarian, Robb. Good job!
grok says
geez thanks Robb…i listen to your podcast and you mention Cipro for bacterial infections. i get home and my doctor leaves a message that this is what i need to take. how long do i need to take off lifting and/or running. i mostly do power lifting now. also would this stop me from working at my job ( i am on a ladder all day) thanks
Jason says
Cipro puts you at “hi risk for tendon and ligament rupture.” I just got off cipro a week ago, and then went back to the GYM and tore something in my back doing a 3×3 set of 85% of max dead lifts on the 28th (the day before they put out the pod cast). Wish I would of know this a few days sooner. But at least now I know what went wrong, thanks for all the great information.
@ grok, take it slow, please learn from my mistakes.
grok says
Thanks for the advice. i have to take it but not looking forward to it. just got my lab work today. they are telling me to take it for only 2 weeks.i plan to run a race sunday then start the cipro monday. if you dont mind me asking, what did you have? i had bad intestinal problems. like after i run on sunday ( 5k) i will have intestinal pain for 2-3 days. another question: could you work during when you were on cipro?
Paleoslayer says
We here in the lunatic fringe fully support your libertarian ideals.
Paleoslayer says
Recent study on changes in jaws of agriculturalists vs hg’s
Global human mandibular variation reflects differences in agricultural and hunter-gatherer subsistence strategies
http://m.pnas.org/content/early/2011/11/15/1113050108.abstract?sid=003c1231-ae9c-47b8-8870-f081b1f22c04
Becky Cooper (@fabbecky) says
Okay, lay off us feminist liberals! Great podcast guys, I love listening to you two, but man, your comment about liberals run amok (or whatever) and touch feely feminism wanting everyone to be the same… Don’t paint me with that brush! 🙂 I am a died hard liberal & feminist – and a special ed teacher. I don’t believe everyone should have the same stuff or any crap like that, I believe everyone should get what THEY need to succeed to the best of THEIR abilities (comes from Special Ed stuff). Not everybody gets the same toys or stuff or even great genetics, but we should all have the opportunity to do the best with what we do get. If that includes performance enhancers, so be it. But even in the education system I buck the conventional wisdom, I guess that’s why Paleo makes so much sense to me 🙂
Keep up the great work!
Vanessa says
Hey Robb, why the move to Reno? We’re all curious.
saulj says
regarding I, Caveman home edition. As a person who has spent a fair amount of time outdoors including as an instructor, I would like to agree with Robb, things can get really bad, really fast outdoors. Read Into The Wild and Accidents in North American Mountaineering, Death in Yosemite, etc. Once you get cold, and it doesn’t have to be that cold for your core to get cold, you don’t think clearly and things (like starting a fire) take way longer to get done. Combine cold and hungry and you are asking for trouble.
There are many great reasons to go outdoors. Before you use it as testing ground, make sure that you have sufficient time outdoors to make sure that you are testing what you should be testing, i.e. not just staying alive. As with exercise, if you are just trying to survive you aren’t learning that much, if anything.
kem says
Matt Ridley’s writing has been going downhill since “The Red Queen” (a must read) and “The Origins of Virtue” (a should read), both books directly related to his academic background.
I seem to remember he was born to a wealthy British nobleman, educated at Eton and Oxford and along with his doctorate in zoology and writng career, was a director of a UK bank that happily accepted government bailout. He was/is a bit of a global warming denier.
The lectures and interviews with Ridley with regards to “The Rational Optomist” have not encouraged me to pick up the tome. Personally, I side with those that study ecology (Wilson, Hanson, Lovelock, Flannery, etc.) directly and find the Earth in a far more parlous state.
Kyle says
So Ridley’s book argues that we should specialize? And presumably the authors you mention are in favor of people being more of “renaissance men” having multiple talents?
It’s an interesting debate.
I thought the red queen was awesome, made great sense and really changed my perspective.
henry says
Robb,
I’m really looking forward to your review on the Rational Optimist. Check this review out. It would be rad if you addressed this author’s points of contention, directly or not.
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/06/13/books/review/Easterly-t.html
keep up the good work!
Henry D
Brian PCF says
@Robb – Hey dude, thanks for the shout on the Podcast – I’m was listening to 106 this morning, I’m playing catch up because of wedding/honeymoon stuff, but got the heads up from a buddy.
Really glad you liked to book, definitely gave me a much better perspective on work/trade/training, etc.
@Kem – I enjoy your Ridley CV, because the adjective “evil” was so deftly implied. Allow me to fill in those that missed it:
“…born to an EVIL wealthy British noblemen, educated at Evil Eton and Evil Oxford…..Evil UK Bank…Evil global warming denier.”
Global Warming is a religion, not a science.
Malthus was wrong.
As in the US, when you say the government bailed out the banks, I think what you mean is “the Crony Capitalist system decided to print more money.” If there’s is some kind of membrane between “Banks” and “Government”, I have yet to find where it’s effective with respect to either employees or fiat money.
kem says
knock yourself out, dude.
I only pointed out that Ridley’s upbringing was more privileged than most and would colour the way he sees the world. In no way have I implied “evil”.
There are four well thumbed books by the author in my library. Yours?
Cristina says
Why you hatin on femininity?
If I want to surround themselves with feminine dudes and not use steroids, that doesn’t mean I want these things to be illegal.
paleoslayer says
“male animals have a finite sum of energy that they can spend on testosterone or immunity to disease, but not both at the same time.”
― Matt Ridley
Samuli Pahalahti says
Matt Ridley has a great TED talk about the things he writes in Rational Optimist: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OLHh9E5ilZ4
Dr Paula says
re question 2- Paleo Research- March 3, 2011 NY Times Magazine had an article about David Murdock, a billionaire who is trying to live to be 125 by diet and lifestyle. He built and runs the North Carolina Research Center “a scientific center dedicated to his conviction that plants, eaten in copious quantities and the right variety, hold the promise of optimal health and maximal life span.” Maybe he’d be interested in helping out with the dietary studies you talked about in your podcast. Also, with unemployment at 8.6%, maybe some of the unemployed would be willing to participate as research subjects for money or food and a bed. It’s about time we did some real scientific studies about diet and health, and not lie about the results like they did with the Framingham study.
Ninja-Caveman says
Robb and Greg, I submitted a very similar question to the one about PEDs to the blog, it was covered all but by one point. What role does age play into the use or not use performance enhancing substances dilemma? Regardless of the morals here in the U.S., should 15 year olds be taking them? 21? After the age of 28? Anyone who knows something about this feel free to chip in!
Ninja-Caveman says
(To the podcast)**
Robb Wolf says
Crossfit ( oddly enough) had a solid interview with Dave Tate. He made the point that the earlier you use PED’s the less longevity you will have to your career. Get as much as you cn naturally, then assess WHY you need/want them. Fromt hst perspective it’s hard to justify a 15yo taking them. 21? Are they competing in something?
Ninja-Caveman says
Robb, do you have a link or name for the interview? I did check google hastily and found nothing.
I see your points, from which age is it normal for performance to start dropping? Does it depend whether it be olympic lifting, power lifting, crossfitting or running?
Also where does one draw the line with what is a PED and what is not? Anything that improves performance?
I am only just past the age of 20, so I should hold off for as long as I can. That means anabolics surely, now what about say DMAA? Should I stop taking 3 double shots of espresso before lifting?
I hope you can see the point I am making. I want to continue to perform well as long as possible, I am in no hurry. I also want to win however, and you don’t know who in the sport is using the PEDs. Should I stick to natural substances, which come naturally from the earth?
Thank you for taking the time to read over
Jan` says
Hi guys,
Nice to see the shout out for Ridley. I’ve read 2 of his and really enjoy his style. I will admit that I read “Nature vs Nuture” three times because I found it accessible to a lay person and incredibly compelling. Richard Dawkin’s “Selfish Gene” however more eloquent and insightful, (not to say science based rather than journalistic) is a bit harder to take on a first go.
I will say that I agree with Kem’s comments in regards to Ridley’s RA. I was a little dubious of its content, but I loved it for it’s hopeful overtone.
What’s really interesting to me is to find that folks are interested in diet are also interested in the same books. I’m reading Dennet’s “Kinds of Minds” and I recommend that to any vegans gone meat eater (like myself) who have lingering doubts about animal husbandry and “sentient” beings.
Also reading “Sex at Dawn” and am waiting for the polyamorous shoe to drop at some point in the book. Ya, ok, we are more like bonobos than chimps. And yes, there certainly are a lot of myths of human coupling that don’t hold up under any scrutiny. However, having already looked into that heady idea, (which is to say the idea that human beings are more sexually communal than our current social model would allow) I’ve decided that polygamy or polyamory fail on economics – having multiple partners at one time would just exhaust the crap out of any normal person. Got no TIME!
Also, as I read “Sex at Dawn” I’m remembering Matt Ridley talking about certain voles that had a great deal of vasopressin receptors that may have correlated with apparent shows of jealousy to other voles who might be interested in doing the old switcheroo with matched voles. I may be misremembering, but I know some sort of hormonal thing happens when my man happens to take a few extra minutes eyeing some good looking lady at the gym. (But, bless him, he’s getting sneakier.)
And of course Dennet would argue (I presume) that vole levels of vasopressin and aggression related to vole overtures do not equal the kind of jealousy that would initiate a long discussion about the acceptable length of time to leave one’s eyes on a given female in the gym, while one is walking home from the gym with one’s partner.
So, yeah, I’m reading a lot of stuff and there are some overlapping and paradoxical narratives.
Wondering about the overall impact of sugar alcohols and my intake of stevia and coconut milk are a restful indulgence in my quest to improve well being. The supreme irony is that those items (dietary) will likely have the greatest impact on the net quality of my life.
So, why read Dawkins, Ridley, Dennet and the like? I should read more of Robb’s work…
😉 Love your work Robb. And I’m pretty thrilled to find you and others in your circle reading the kind of books that talk about why we want to extend our lives and improve cognition through better diet.
grayson says
Hi Robb,
Dunno if this will get lost in the comment graveyard as its such an old thread, but I was listening to this podcast in the car last night while catching up and wham! someone actually mentions the Cipro thing! I need help: Of course there’s the controversial ‘black box’ warning about tendon rupture and stuff, but there’s really nothing more than superficial shit on the webz. I was on cipro for 3 months, ending about 3 months ago, and was on prednisone at the same time. I don’t hink I actually ruptured my tendons (though I don’t even really know what that means), but even 3 months later there’s still something wrong with the tendons behind my knees. they are weak, sore, and I constantly feel like I hyper-extended my knee. Not acute pain per se, but really, really uncomfortable; it feels like my knees could give out at any time.
I’ve always been very active, still sprint occasionally, walk a lot for work, knew about the tendon thing but thought i was out of the woods for a while but now i’m thinking not. What is the mechanism for all this? I kind of get the mitochondria thing, but why tendons? molecular mimicry? will it *ever* go away? am i fucked?
thanks SO MUCH in advance and i’ll probably try again somewhere else on the site if i don’t hear anything.
Robb Wolf says
You just need to ramp up gradually…it has something to do with collagen production but the pharmacology is fuzzy for me.
grayson says
Dude, you are just an amazing guy. Would that everyone had the altruism you exhibit! I was pretty freaked out yesterday with the Cipro thing but I think I’ll be fine. Vaporizing all of my gut flora probably didn’t help either.
Yesterday when you responded to my shot-in-the-dark query I was just headed in to the whole foods for some shopping. while in there i was accosted by a nice-looking older woman who at first wanted to talk about baseball, but things quickly shifted the Good Word of the Lord. When I told her I wasn’t sure how I felt about all that, she said God blessed me regardless.
So, Robb Wolf, I would like to pass that blessing on to you. That and all the NCM’s you can drink should I ever meet you. You deserve it!
Robb Wolf says
You made my day! Thanks.
grayson says
PS it was actually almost 5 months ago — it coincides with my paleo-conversion gig. i quit all that shite and got on the good path around the beginning of the year
grayson says
okay, i think i’m good! delete away these comments at your will. i searched the forum (forgot about that!) and found a good thread with this link
http://www.the-spearhead.com/2010/06/21/fluoroquinolone-antibiotics-such-as-cipro-and-levaquin-ruin-lives/
that i think is answering all my questions. TWGIF wins as always